I have converted my current Linux servers on ev1 to FreeBSD 4.9.
Although, I'd really rather run 5.1, it has alot more newer code and features that I need.

I am wondering if anyone else here with ev1servers is wanting 5.1 also?

(No, you cant upgrade from 4.x to 5.x (we all wish))

Thanks.
-Jason

Hi Jason.

At the moment the 5.x branch of FreeBSD is still development code and not recommended for production environments.

I believe that with the release of 5.3 the 5.x source tree will be branched to STABLE.

5.x is fine for workstations but I would say it is really best to stick with something like 4.9 from the STABLE branch for your production servers.

If you just want a testing and development server I think you probably should be able to CVSUP the source to 5.x and build a new world and kernel. I personally havn't done this myself though. Anybody else cvsup'ed to 5.x and built a new world and kernel?

Ok man your not very up on FreeBSD. I wasnt asking to be told what FreeBSD 5.1 is. I know thats not considered stable. I personally dont care whats considered, I care about what I have done with it and how it runs for me.

I've been working with FreeBSD for ~6 years now. I know whats going on.

I run 5.1 on alot of very heavily used production systems without a single problem.

... And no You _CANNOT_ CVSup to the Newest 5.x on a 4.x machine and have it work. 5.X is completely different on devices, system code and kernel. I have even been brave and have tried to get around it a few times on some home machines. Flat impossible.

Thanks.
-Jason

Sorry for telling you how to suck eggs...

Considering the trouble other FreeBSD users on here are having with trying to get EV1 to run a multi-partition image ala handbook, I don't see them sticking their neck out enough to offer anything other than the last stable release.

Rob

Well that is interesting to know. I had always though you would onlu have to build a new 5.x world then build a new 5.x kernel, install them both and reboot!! Thanks for the tip...

No problem Its ok. Yes I know ev1 does some dumb stuff. I remotely redid my paritioning. I hate that single / crap. .

Thanks fine and dandy, they should offer 5.1 but with an agreement that you get no support if you break it or something. That would be just peachy

-Jason

Err... what's the problem? This can be done via source, or via binaries with my depenguinator.

Neither path is exactly straightforward, but both are possible.

So you cannot upgrade between versions remotely :eek: :confused:

Does that mean unlike the RedHat Enterprise servers which are good for 4-5 years, these FreeBSD Servers will all need to be restored by EV1 when whatever current FreeBSD version End-of-lifes in one year?

You can upgrade from 4.x -> 4.x and 5.x -> 5.x, Etc.
But no you can not upgrade from 4->5. Most people who are using 4 are staying with it as its been followed up on and will be for a while. Same with 5.x. Just depends on the persons preference.

-Jason

You can compile the 5.x code onto a 4.x machine and make installworld on it, and update your /etc and setup the new /dev system and all but 99% of the time the machine wont come back up after a reboot of installing 5.x over 4.x. Atleast I have not been albe todo this.

If you have any details on how to accomplish *completely remotley* from 4.9-STABLE -> 5.1-RELEASE or even 5.2-REL now. Please let me know!

I've done 3.x -> 4.x in the past, but thats a pain also.

Also, from what i've read (dont remember where) you have to be at console and do things in single user mode to switch from 4.x to 5.x (freebsd handbook maybe?)

-Jason

Assuming that you want to keep the files you currently have on disk, the easiest solution is probably:
1. Build and install a 5.x kernel
2. Reboot
3. Create a new filesystem (steal space from swap if necessary), mount it on /mnt/, and use sysinstall to install 5.2-release onto that filesystem.
4. Set up any configuration stuff on the new filesystem.
5. Disklabel and edit /etc/fstab to swap 4.x and 5.x root partitions.
6. Reboot into the 5.x world.

While it is *possible* to update from 4.x to 5.x in-place, swapping filesystems is much easier.

Hey cool, im gonna test this out on my home machine tonight. The only major difference being home machine single ata 40gig, and my ev1 server is 2x73 gig scsi .

I will let you know the results. Thanks again.

Currently in progress of this now . Results within an hour hopefully. (Got other stuff going on too)

Well crap! I have been using freebsd for a long time now...but...

I downloaded the 5.2-rel src onto my 4.9-rel machine here..

Went to 'config MYKERN' and it @#!@#!@#!@#!@#!es about wrong version, so I went ahead and installed the newest config from 5.2 source, that installed just fine, but now when I try to compile the kernel it errors out!

The errors seem to be GCC related, include files not being found.

Not sure im theres something special I need todo or a special way to compile a 5.x kernel on a 4.x machine? Let me know... Thanks!

If you need output of my compile errors, etc. Just say so. I can get them.

-Jason

Err... ok, try running a buildworld (but not installworld!) first. 5.x uses a newer version of gcc; I'm pretty sure it will use the one from the build toolchain if it's available.

Ok, I had thought about that, but wasnt sure. Ok, buildworld running.

Buildworld is still going, its a lil p3 933mhz machine, so itll be a bit. I'm going to goto sleep for the night and then tommorrow first thing ill check on it and give you an update.

-Jason

Well, buildworld finished while I was sleeping, didn't make any difference still getting the GCC-related errors. invalid options and stuff, I would assume I would have to install the newest gcc?

One I had, what if I just used the kernel and modules from the 5.2 cd? It comes with generic kernel and the all the modules. I might be able to put all the files into place correctly. Hmm.

Let me know your thoughts.

...
cc1: Invalid option 'no-align-long-strings'
cc1: unknown C standard 'c99'
cc1: Invalid option '-finline-limit=1500'

Stop in /usr/src/sys/i386/compile/GENERIC
...

Altho, maybe this would compile if I had this 4.9 machine running 4.9-STABLE, does the stable branch of 4.9 have the newer compilers? altho, might not matter with it still being 5.2 code.

-Jason

Ya know what.. Thinking about this for a while now, why do I need to boot off a 5.2 kernel when I will just be booting onto the new 5.2 os anyways? The Generic Kernel is fine for my device needs. Hmm. Maybe im just forgetting something though.

-Jason

Ok damn too many posts in a row from me. But sorry, been spending alot of time on this now. Just thought of something, How can I possibly use the 4.9 sysinstall to install 5.2 when its lookoing for "base" versus "bin"? I am experimenting with this idea, if I can just get 5.2 to install I think i'll have it.

Speaking of using 5.2-rel's sysinstall....I got creative.

I mounted up the 5.2 boot.flp, copied out the mfsroot.gz
ungzipped it and mounted it up and copied the sysinstall
and all related files to a tmp directory and tried to use it.

Fails miserably, core dumps. Im assuming because of 5.x code trying to execute on 4.9 os. If I can just get the new os installed
I think I will be ok. Altho if I was running on 5.x kernel, would the sysinstall for 5.x run? Hmm....

Hmm, I'm not sure what the kernel building problem is; it's been a while since I tried to do a cross-build, but I know it is possible.

In any case, the critical issue is that you have to boot into the 5.x kernel before you can do anything else, since 5.x binaries (including sysinstall) can't run on a 4.x kernel. So get a 5.x GENERIC kernel somehow (rip it from the CD if necessary) and boot that.

Actually, im going to setup a vmware image of 5.2 and get it all preped, write the image to my 2nddary scsi hd and then have ev1 swap the hds for me. hahaha .

Thanks for all the help though, I couldn't find any way to boot from a 5.x kernel, as the 4.x boot loader doesnt support where the files are and the modules are, all different setup in 4.x versus 5.x.

Basically doing my freebsd over linux idea via vmware hd image, but to a 2ndary drive this time, so its fail safe. (ie if it doesnt boot right then they can just switch them back.)

-Jason

I am still going to look more into your way of doing it though.
For future machines.

You don't need VMWare for that -- just use my depenguinator.

Hmm. Well i've never used your stuff, I know vmware idea will work, but maybe I will check out your depenguinator, I thought that it was for going from linux to bsd, this is bsd to bsd? Although, might not make a difference.

Checking out your stuff now Looks schweet!

Ok, this depengiunator is awesome! Great work man!

--Posted in the wrong thread, sorry.

I just put in an order to have my new server re-imaged to FreeBSD, however its dissapointing to hear about the way the filesystem is partitioned. This is both non-standard and less secure, however my biggest problem arises around softupdates which has a *substantial* effect on disk performance. I hope that the technical folks at ev1servers will do some of their own research on the matter and hopefully reconsider the setup of their standard FreeBSD image.

I am glad to see that ev1servers is offering FreeBSD, and it is the prime reason I am going back to leasing a server from them. I think FreeBSD offers definate advantages, especially in upgradeability and ports/package management over Redhat Linux's RPM based system, and for me its still better then the Redhat alternative--even in a crippled state.

Welp so far no luck with the depenguinator, it works as far as booting into the memory-only os and all, that works 100% no problem, but when installing 5.2 (havent tested 5.1, trying that next), I cant even get the machine to boot correctly, always comes up with Invalid Partition. Trying to work around that next, if I can get it to boot onto the new 5.X os, I think i'll have it.

... I get into the new 5.2 os thats loaded in memory (awesome!) ... Then I...

sysinstall
setup my options to have install root of "/slash"
setup partitions one big partition, full size
tell it bootmgr
slices (label) 1gig swap
slices (label) 1gig /slash/
force write now (W) so it sets up /slash
then install base and crypto, all goes fine
and the entire 5.2 os in /slash/
setup all the files in the 5.2 (network, passes, etc)
and then reboot it...

Invalid Partition... hmm..


... End ...

I have tried to both 'DD' (F) (Dangerously Dedicated) and Normal partitioning setup and I install the boot mgr each time of course. So not sure what the deal is.... hmm...

Any thoughts?

Im trying to find information on manually (cmd line) setting up the boot loader and setting it properly, as that would be great, but so far I cant find didly on howto do that without using sysinstall and sysinstall is not exactly straight forward for "just" bootmgr installs.

-Jason

All I can really say here is "it worked for me"

Does this machine have any 4.x bits lying around? A 4.x loader trying to understand a UFS2 partition would probably produce a similar message.

Yeah thats what i'm starting to think, I dont think that the 5.x boot loader is being properly installed, trying to get that forced and working.

If there was only such a thing as "lilo -U" and "lilo -I" hahaha
(Trying to manually force install of the bootmgr from 5.2).


Couple questions... how are you setting your passwords and adding accounts to the new installed 5.2? since its not mounted in /, passwd, adduser etc dont work. I am just doing it the hardway (manually edited and pwd.mkdb). Just wondering if you had any simpler ways.

I'll keep posting here with any new results...

-Jason

The easiest way to do configuration like that is `chroot /newworld/ /bin/sh`

Oh hahaha.. Duh Jason! I should of thought of that.

Ok, well that helps a bunch, but then still need the proper boot loader.. grr...

/me keeps at it.

-Jason

I have learned alot about the entire 4 stage bsd boot process. I also have learned how to force the boot manager install, and configure it, etc. So hopefully soon i'll be sucessfull!

5.2 is stable enough trust me! I have it running a big mail/web server here and have been using it on my laptop since 5.0 came out.
Its our machines anyway! If we want 5.2 you must let us have it its just not fair.

Yeap, I 100% completely agree on both points.

Did anyone get 5.x on an EV1 server? If so, by what means?

Kind Regards,

TechBrat

I've installed 5.2.1 onto a two-drive EV1 server by "depenguinating" the second drive, mounting the 5.2.1 ISO image, and then installing back onto the first drive. This should be possible even with only one drive, but I haven't had a chance to test that.

Many thanks Doctor C!!

I saw your depenguinator a while ago and it looked fantastic. Great work and thanks for helping the BSD community!

I'm off to turn some Penguins into Daemons...

Kind Regards,

TechBrat (Chris)

Could your describe in detail how you do that ?
It will be very helpful for many people in this forum.

I have sever with 4.9 installed and 2 SCSI drives and want to upgrade it to 5.3 and repartition hard drives.

Thank you !

Well, I haven't really been able to do any test conversions yet as I've been spending most of my time these days supporting my painful RH servers and building (and documenting) a new virtual hosted FreeBSD 5.x server in a VMWare image.

So far, it's proving that FreeBSD with various open source software and the odd custom script is as good, if not better than Control Panel's like Ensim and CPanel.

Is anyone providing a service to upgrade a new 4.9 box to, say 5.3?

Regards,

TechBrat.

Not yet, but I could do so if people are interested.

cperciva its possible to install FreeBSD 5.x into the second disk while running 4.x on the first disk then reboot and it will boot as 5.x ?

care to point out a small howto on how doing it?


Thanks in advance.

This may not help the current conversation much, but it fits under the general subject...

Just ordered one of the value series freebsd machines and it came configured with FreeBSD 5.3-Release.